Does not appear that CMS will have video; they will have live scoring. Whatever they do, you can access it by clicking on the CMS Tennis link on this site and finding the live scoring link and/or the video link.
Update: Host site CMS will have live video for West Regional matches, beginning tomorrow at 1:00 PM Pacific Standard Time with #7 California Lutheran vs. #16 Redlands.
I think CMS is the biggest wildcard in this tournament. They have the potential to do anything from losing in the round of 16 to winning the whole thing
Very true. This CMS team is unlike any other one of their predecessors. Year in year out they were a powerhouse but when it came time for the big event they just always seemed to find a way to disappoint. This year’s team by no means dominated their opponents as they have in the past but that incredible talent is still there and they are wayyyyyy more battle-hardened than any incarnation of the CMS tennis team before them. Their spectrum is anywhere from pulling a Swarthmore match to also bringing that team that beat Amherst 6-3 last year. I firmly think that if they do manage to make it out of the region of death (surely favored but you just never know) than they will make tidy work of Kenyon and will pose a SERIOUS threat and I’ll even take them for the upset of Herst.
This year will result in another Emory v. Amherst NCAA final. Do not know why we are showing Washu or an undeserving Redlands any attention. My pick goes to Emory. They seem to have something different this year, and Browning is at his best, showing this by going a solid 20-0 this season. Amherst looks like they have dropped a level from last year, and it is certainly open for the taking (for maybe 1 or 2 other teams). I Look forward to this weekend and the next couple weeks where we will see most of these responses either crumble or come to fruition. Final 4- Amherst v CMS, Emory v Williams. Final- Emory over Herst.
Despite valid points regarding Wash U and Bates, but there are some exciting early round matchups in the tournament:
Cal Lu vs Redlands (law of averages and frustration from losing so many close matches may finally turn in Redland’s favor, plus doubles will save their day)
P-P vs Santa Cruz (UCSC looking to reassert themselves when it counts)
Skidmore (now at full strength with Jimmy Sherpa back) vs Trinity (TX), two tough teams with strong doubles lineups…should be quite a battle
Whitman (still looking for respect despite a great year)vs under-rated and very tough NC Wesleyan
Coe vs Grinnel (neither team ranked or a threat to Wash U. but it should be another nailbiter)
Why is everyone talking about the controversy surrounding Redlands vs. Bates, but no one is really talking about the decision between WashU & Bates? Redlands beat Bates. Whether the match was played in February or yesterday, Redlands has the direct win. But what about how the seasons of Bates and WashU stack up against each another?
1) Neither team lost any matches to teams ranked outside the top 14 at the time the matches were played.
2) Both teams played top teams close (4-5 loses to Kenyon/Cruz for WashU, and 4-5 loses to Amherst/Middlebury for Bates).
3) Both teams beat all the teams they played that finished the season ranked below them. The best of those matches include:
WASHU: Carnegie (neutral), Case Western (neutral), and Skidmore (neutral)
BATES: Mary Wash (away), Trinity CT (away), MIT (home)
There is no difference between these schools unless i’m forgetting something…
Bates beat Johns Hopkins 7-2 at Hopkins while WashU lost 5-4 to Johns Hopkins at a neutral site. If their resumes are so similar except for the INDIRECT WIN the Bobcats have over the Bears, then how does it make sense that WashU is in the tournament, and Bates is not?
My guess Big Jeff B. is that the Ncaa comittee did not want 5 NESCAC schools. Clearly, Bates is more deserving than Wash U. Bates will be fine. Next year should be a really strong one for them and hopefully they will not have to relay on fate. I hope those kids will use this for motivation to have a great year.
Yup. Well said. Of course you also missed the point where the NCAA apparently awards 90% of your seed on what you have done in previous years. Other than that spot on and I completely agree with you.
Again, realize that if this is done for one sport, it must be done for all sports. So each of the 20 or so sports would have to agree to this “election” to move out teams who can afford to pay their own way. Don’t see that happening.
I have absolutely no experience in dealing with the NCAA rules, but I don’t think I’m bad at proposing possible solutions to perceived problems. If this change must be approved for all 20 sports to be used for men’s NCAA tennis, so be it. I don’t think that should be a big deal in terms of the ease of it being applied to all sports.
Guidelines could be established that the NCAA selection committee would only move a team that applied to be available to be shipped out of a region, at their own expense, in the interests of attempting to even out the overall parity between NCAA regions, and that the selection committee would have the total discretion to accept or reject any application by any team indicating that they would accept such a move outside their region. The overall parity guideline SHOULD BE IN PLACE NOW ANYWAY, AND BE REQUIRED BY THE NCAA SELECTION COMMITTEE TO FOLLOW (and, if not, should be immediately put in place in the future), so this would be just a minor application, or example, of how the overall parity rule could be applied.
However, I must say if this overall parity guideline is currently in place, the selection committee certainly did not do a good job of following it this year, as many of the comments to this blog address.
One possible solution to the problem of the west region’s yearly overabundance of quality teams is to request that teams in that region submit a statement that they are willing to fly out to another region, and pay for all of their own travel expenses, if the NCAA feels it would equalize overall regional quality (which presumably the selection committee wants to do). So, for instance, if PP, the #2 seed in the west, submitted that request on a timely basis before the selection committee made their request (which would have to be done before their league championship tourney, which is right before the NCAA selections are determined), then the NCAA could ship them to another region of their choice (not P-P’s choice), P-P would pay for their travel expenses, and then the selection committee could ship another team at the NCAA’s expense, using the existing three team 500 mile rule, such as Texas Tyler, to the west region, from the Emory region. Arguably this doesn’t change the overall selection rules, at least not much, so it may be deemed to be consistent with the “one rule for all D3 sports” rule.
No, that would provide an unfair advantage to the team making the election to be shipped out of their region, which the selection committee could choose to accept or reject in their total discretion.
I agree with your theory in principle. However, this is completely unfair for schools/teams with less money than others. A private school team can have a better path to the NCAA’s then UC Santa Cruz who could not afford to pay their way out of their region?
I should also point out, in addition to my comment made below, that it would seem that it would be a very rare experience for an NCAA selection committee to deem it necessary to ship a team, that requested it be shipped, to another region to achieve overall parity between each region.
Off the top of my head, I can’t see that occurring in any other sport, except maybe lacrosse, which seems to be a sport the players in east excel in compared to other areas of the country, though I don’t even know if there is a D3 championship for that sport. If I am correct on this, the unfairness issue you raise relating to private schools is severely diminished.
P-P will probably be the #3 seek in the west region, but it doesn’t make any difference to whether my idea makes any sense. As long as I’m writing this, I should point out that if P-P were able to make this “election,” it would run the risk of being shipped to a regional where the top seed is ranked even higher than CMS. However, P-P, if they wanted to spend the money, might think it would be a good idea to go elsewhere and potentially even play a tougher team than CMS, for several reasons, to go play somewhere out of state in the NCAA’s.
Pretty sure he was insinuating that they (Washington University of St. Louis) were not the “creators” of the bracket. Thus, don’t direct any anger towards them or their program because they were uninvolved in the process. Obviously they are included in the bracket…aka “made the bracket”. But you clearly completely mis-read his post.
On another note, can we get down to talking about the actual tournament at this point? Obviously there are some flaws in the process and I agree that Bates got the short end of the stick…But it is really tough to argue when you directly lose 7-2 (only 2 wins being in 3 set breakers), no matter when the match was. Again, we can all agree some things should/need to be changed, but nothing’s about to change between now and Friday…So can we begin to talk about tennis, and the matches that will be played. And save the banter and rule changing posts until after the tournament?
Comments on Wash U. They didn’t make the bracket. They also did what they needed to do to make the tournament. They beat Case, DePauw, Chicago and when it came time to make it happen they came back from 3-0 down after doubles to beat Carnegie 5-4. Bates and Redlands couldn’t do it when they needed to. Redlands was rewarded for not getting the job done and Bates wasn’t. Wash U will have to beat Gustavus who could sweep them in doubles, but in the end Wash U didn’t make the bracket.
Redlands beat bates 7-2, and the two matches bates won were won in third sets with scores of 11-9 and 12-10. i don’t care what the argument is about their recent performance, redlands was a handful of points from winning 9-0. game set match redlands showed they were better than bates and thus why they got the 7th pool C bid
I think there is too much complaining. We don’t live in a perfect world and it’s not a perfect draw, but I don’t think it was surprise to anybody that something like this would happen – NCAA has had this method for who knows how long. This happened this year and will happen in the future. Sooner the people get over their disappointment and focus on some incredible match-ups that the draw actually offers, the better for all of us.
I repeat a question i asked earlier: How long has the NCAA been doing the selection process this way? Only 10-11 years I believe. And can someone explain how it was done before?
this is all a joke. i mean, it’s great and all that the teams who win their weak conferences are given a chance to play in NCAA’s, but how about rewarding the top teams (i.e., all the aforementioned teams who are NOT in the tourney) with a chance to compete in post season play? sorry but it’s not like schools like grinnell deserve a chance over say, bates.
Also the unranked teams who are in ridiculously easy conferences who get auto-bids need to stop being allowed to go to the tournament. They just dont’ compare to all the nationally ranked teams who are in the teens or in the 20′s that don’t make it. Just not fair.
Because of the set up that NCAA has for D3, I think a plan that could really work out is, have the national rankings flat out make the the field. Expand the rankings to the top 50 in the nation instead of 30. Allowed the top 48 teams to play in the bracket. The top 16 teams get byes. I know that traveling would come into play but I’m sure the price to having an actual fair bracket actually made for once in D3 would outweigh the cost to actually have the teams travel a little bit more to make it fair.
It couldn’t/won’t happen because:
1) NCAA institutes a method for postseason across the board, not just tennis, so when considering what is best for one sport, it likely won’t make sense for the rest.
2) $$. As nice as it would be, the NCAA isn’t going to think that the cost is outweighed by fairness. It wouldn’t be as simple as just adding one flight. It would be adding a flight for each sport. Imagine doing the bracket based on the rankings, expanding the rankings, and then trying to create balanced regionals. The amount of flights would fluctuate each year, and it would likely mean multiple flights for just one region. Multiply that by the 20 or so (number of D3 championships) and cost becomes a major issue.
I love the idea of a championship that is representative of the quality of D3 tennis, and the NCAA does itself harm the way it is set up, but I don’t see that changing anytime soon.
There are 6 teams that have golden roads to the elite 8 and then 2 tough regions. I may be a little impartial when saying this but I feel NC Wes can pull out the win against Whitman. They have the talent to beat Emory but can they all pull it together the same day? I don’t know but can’t wait to see what happens. Looking forward to the Middlebury-Hopkins match. You never know what can happen in this one. Bowdoin-Trinity will probably come down to who wins doubles. I would love to see a possible whitewater or gustavus upset over Wash U. More than likely won’t happen but would make for a good story for one of these other programs. The California region is always a battle for all these teams and I feel for them. It can basically come down to who is on that day. Amherst won’t be tested until the Final 4 with a possible Kenyon or CMS match. Not the best draw I’ve ever seen but it is what it is. Looking forward to seeing what happens. D
The talent level was certainly evident against Kenyon and Chicago this year and NC Wesleyan had a great year only losing twice. Whitman will have their hands full and probably will rightfully view themselves as underdogs, I imagine. Plus Whitman will be crossing three time zones to play…farther than any other team has to travel. My vote is this regional is the second toughest behind California, though #1 seed Emory is arguably stronger than CMS as a #1 seed. And if NC Wesleyan players can match up and compete well against Emory players (and you should know) then that only proves my point.
You mean partial (biased), not impartial (unbiased), correct? Also, although the results may be outdated, I just looked up results between Emory and NCW from the fall regionals: Halpern (#5 singles) beat Rumyantsev (#3 singles) in three sets, while Ruderman (#6) beat Khussainov (#1) in straights. Like I said, that was some time ago, but still interesting to think about. No doubt that NCW is talented; however, they yet to break through with a win of this caliber. If they can step up their doubles play, much as Kjellberg and Rumyantsev did in the fall regionals, then they very well may become a force to reckon with. There is no doubt they will feel disrespected in regards to the rankings and will come out firing against Whitman.
Even amidst all of the issues that have arisen, this tournament has a lot of entertaining matchups to offer. Can’t wait to see another big upset.
Dustin, nice comments and I would like to respond. My thoughts are: NC wes has no chance against Emory. Middlebury will destroy Hopkins. Bowdoin will destroy Trinity-TX. Wash U? Don’t care…they have no business in the tourney. In the end, Nobody and I mean Nobody will come close to touching Amherst. They are heads and shoulders above anyone else in the country. I am not an Amherst fan, but a realist.
I think you’re a little too excited there. Remember this is the national tournament and you’re saying that teams are going to get “destro[ed]”. I don’t think so. First, Middlebury/Hopkins is going to be a good match I think. Hopkins’s singles is very very strong and middlebury’s mid-bottom lineup isnt as top notch as one might think. Second, although I agree that Emory will cruise in their region, I’m not sure if I would go ahead and give the win to Wesleyan over Whitman so easily. That should be a battle. And thirdly, remember that Trinity spanked Bowdoin earlier this season. Sure it was in March but Trinity’s strengths are Bowdoin’s as well. Bowdoin has been sweeping the dubs against everyone and remember that Trinity swept them. Basically my point is that you shouldn’t overlook any regional (except maybe Herst’s regional) because this is the national tournament. Weird things have happened.
Sorry for the essay but even though the tournament draw seems all messed up, it wil be interesting to see the how the matches play out. With some of these big time schools battling it out. As a fan of D3 tennis, that’s all I can ask for.
NCWC does have a shot at Emory if they get past Whitman. Granted it is a small shot and if they are not up after doubles they won’t win. I also feel Middlebury beats down on Hopkins just based on previous years results in NCAA. I am not an Amherst fan either but I think you are right that they will be holding the trophy at the end of the year. I am glad that the tournament is in Cary so I can see all the Elite 8 matches without having to fly. And yeah I meant partial. It was late when I was writing and my 14 month old son was running around. All I am saying is watch for the Bishops to try to send Modise out on a good note as this is his last season bc he is going D1 next year. D
CMS Regional. 4 teams top 10 (#5,6,7,9) and Redlands #16 in the nation. D3 needs to start doing it like D1 teams do. I know that D3 doesn’t have enough money to do all that, but these team draws are looking just absolutely ridiculous. Possibly make the final site for the top 16 teams. California is getting killed by the location and the distance they are from everyone. Also the unranked teams who are in ridiculously easy conferences who get auto-bids need to stop being allowed to go to the tournament. They just dont’ compare to all the nationally ranked teams who are in the teens or in the 20’s that don’t make it. Just not fair.
Because of the set up that NCAA has for D3, I think a plan that could really work out is, have the national rankings flat out make the the field. Expand the rankings to the top 50 in the nation instead of 30. Allowed the top 48 teams to play in the bracket. The top 16 teams get byes. I know that traveling would come into play but I’m sure the price to having an actual fair bracket actually made for once in D3 would outweigh the cost to actually have the teams travel a little bit more to make it fair.
I love your plan.Perhaps it needs a little tweaking but the concept is first rate. I made a similar point in a previous post: to have 5 top 20 teams in one region and then Wash U placed where they are…weird. Frankly, this is a quasi- national championship. Until the regions are more equitable, some teams are going to be fresher. Finally, it seems like CMS, Cal Lu, P-P, Redlands have to play each other over and over and only one team has a chance to get to the final 8…It’s a great tournament but not a fair, true national championship.
I know people probably won’t agree, but Emory’s draw could be pretty tough. If it plays out as the rankings go and they can make it to the finals rematch with Amherst, they’ll play #20 W&L, #11 Whitman (still an unknown), #12 Middlebury (tough out at this point), #3 Williams (only one speed bump this season), then #1 Amherst (seemingly unstoppable).
Not an easy road at all for the #2 team, though that pales in comparison to the CMS Regionals draw. That’s going to be a bloodbath.
Everyone in the Emory region got screwed. Emory will almost certainly get out of that region, but compare that draw to Amherst’s. They just have to beat TCNJ or Vassar (two teams they could beat with their “B” lineup)
Ignoring the random Wheaton spammer and the raging Redlands controversy, I feel like this bracket really sucks for Whitman. They put together a solid season, beat Cruz, and then got stuffed in a regional with Emory. Even if you think the Cruz win was fluky it’s still pretty ridiclous.
Also Redlands: I feel this blog will have a meltdown if Redlands beats Cal-Lu, just saying. While maybe Redlands isn’t the most deserving team in the tournament from Pool C, I’m actually fine with them. Direct over Bates (no matter how long ago it was) and no bad losses. I think equal arguments can be made for their exclusion and inclusion.
Just going to throw this out there, Whitman played Cruz when one of there top doubles and singles players wasn’t even in the line up because he was ineligible at the time. The win isn’t as legit as everyone may think. The reason for Cruz’s success if having that one player back in the singles and doubles line up for the second half of the season. This is why they are so good now. They weren’t nearly as strong as it clearly shows without that last starting player.
To be fair to Whitman, they beat the same team that beat CMS, Trinity, and Wash U, so it’s not like the Cruz team they beat was weak. Also, Larsen hasn’t really done much for Cruz since he’s been back except solidify their doubles lineup. Finally, the Whitman/Cruz match wasn’t really that close. 6-3 Whitman with match points in one of the matches they lost; whereas, Cruz lost pretty soundly in their 6 losses.
All that aside, Whitman hasn’t looked great since then, and shouldn’t really be complaining about their draw because at least they’re not in California where they would have little or no chance of even getting to the Sweet Sixteen.
Whitman really should not be upset. They are near the top, if not at the top of the list at being the highest ranked, weak team. If that makes sense. They do have a decent chance at doing well in the region that they got selected to be in. I just really think California needs to be split up. It’s 5 teams who play each other ALL THE TIME! how is that fair to not give 4 top 10 teams a chance to make it to the elite 8. Only 1 team gets a chance.
Also to include about Whitman, they beat no teams inside the top 20 (besides Cruz without their full lineup) and the 3 teams they beat that are even nationally ranked aren’t that impressive of wins. They beat all weak teams to get the record they have. Have them fly out to Southern California since they are close and see how they stack up against Claremont, Pomona, Cal Lu and Redlands. They are like the Boise State of D3tennis. They kill a bunch of weak teams and have no big wins during the season. And that one match against Cruz was as if Cruz was without their starting quarterback (A lot weaker)
Totally agree on potential blog meltdown but I’m calling it now, Redlands will beat Cal Lu in that play in match. I don’t see them losing a 3rd time to them with the way Cal Lu is skidding and the bad blood between the two teams now should propel them over their rival. That doesn’t change the fact that they were completely unable to win any big match in the season and have no shot to come out of the region but I do think that Cal Lu is quickly fading and won’t be able to get the Wilson win a second time. My prediction is more a loss a faith in Cal Lu now than it is an endorsement for Redlands. Of course they could prove just how unclutch they are and lose to this team a 3rd time but for once I think they’ll do it.
this bracket is a joke for several reasons: 1) Wash U as a 1 seed. 2) Cruz PP Cal Lu Redlands and CMS all in the same region 3) Whitman drawing NCW in Emory’s region. I guess I can see how Redlands gets in over Bates, but thats a toss up. Overall, some really awful decision made
It’s the system but it does seem that two West Coast teams deserve to have a shot at the final 8. Those teams have to keep beating up on EACH other. Hopefully the winner of that region will go to Cary mentally tough…no cupcakes there.
Wheaton is questionable to be in. If there was one more Pool B it would probably be there’s for the taking. Johnson at 1 is a solid player but one of the cciw coaches said he is leaving. They do have a win over Grinnell and an indirect win over Coe (both in the tournament) and had a close match with Luther. Sadly for them try are in the cciw. Last 10 years it’s winner has made it except for Carthage in 2011…further pushing the point that because of the one less pool c bid, they got screwed.
I’d be interested in seeing an informal ranking of regionals from hardest to easiest (or vice versa)–i.e., the hardest and easiest paths to the quarters.
Wash U has a good deal on one hand, but they also have to play Amherst if they squeak out of their region– so much for the final 4 streak. I look forward to their match vs. Gustavus. Actually, will Gustavus beat Whitewater? They lost to them in the regular season.
No its a complete cakewalk. They don’t deserve that easy path to the final 8. I could care less about what happens when they get to play Amherst, I’m upset because they don’t deserve that easy opportunity to get there in the first place.
Whoever is using the capital letters and freaking out at everyone’s comments should probably relax. You don’t seem very well informed and you should realize that much of this tournament is determined based on what you are ranked in your respective region. Thats how the NCAA works, much of it is based on equal opportunity. That is probably why washu and Redlands are in a bates isn’t.
Wow WashU once again has a ridiculously soft path to the final 8. Really selection committee? Couldn’t put Whitman or Trin Tx there since you were already flying them? Instead you place them on teams with far better seasons? What a joke.
Doubles and Singles SELECTIONS come out May 9th in the early afternoon most likely. The DRAWS will be made i believe a day or two before the individual tournament actually begins.
Wheaton got worked? A team that doesn’t have a top 30 win and only took 1 point off of a ranked opponent? That’s who got worked??
I think you mixed Wheaton up with Whitman. I’m no Whitman fan, but you’ve got to feel bad for those guys. Not only do they not host or have a #1 seed, they were drawn with NC Wesleyan and EMORY. Yes, Whitman’s record is much less impressive than many other teams, but they’re undefeated – and they draw EMORY! That’s just cold. In fact, it’s entirely within the realm of possibilities that Whitman may not even win a round – NC Wesleyan is extremely dangerous…
And of course, there’s the California regional that features four top 10 teams… But by all means, continue telling us that Wheaton got worked.
i agree, i can’t see how wheaton could have made the tournament. Yea, they had a nice season with 12 in a row at the end, but who did they beat in those 12? Not sure if those comments were a joke or not…
Anonymous on May 7, 2012 at 3:55 pm
Wheaton is questionable to be in. If there was one more Pool B it would probably be there’s for the taking. Johnson at 1 is a solid player but one of the cciw coaches said he is leaving. They do have a win over Grinnell and an indirect win over Coe (both in the tournament) and had a close match with Luther. Sadly for them try are in the cciw. Last 10 years it’s winner has made it except for Carthage in 2011…further pushing the point that because of the one less pool c bid, they got screwed.
They didn’t get “screwed.” There is one less Pool B slot, and they’re clearly behind all of the current Pool B holders in terms of getting one of those spots. Their results simply don’t indicate that Wheaton should be included in the field.
Moreover, their wins over Grinnell and Coe are irrelevant since those teams qualified by winning their conferences. Since Wheaton isn’t part of an AQ conference, they don’t have that opportunity. That doesn’t mean that they’ve been “screwed,” it’s simply the way the rules work. Bates and Whitman – those are teams that got “screwed.” And besides, don’t you think teams that narrowly missed the cut like Bates would easily be able to have wins over the vaunted Grinnell and Coe if they had played those teams?
Simply stated, Wheaton has no reason whatsoever to complain.
Wheaton didn’t get screwed at all. At best one could say that they had bad luck with the one less bid this year for non-AQs. While winning their conference was great for them, their best wins were Elmhurst x2 (12th in the central region at their peak, and Grinnell. If you want to talk about teams getting screwed, look at a team like Chicago.
As uninspired as Redlands’ inclusion is, they have a better overall record than Bates. Yes, Bates has a better win (v. Johns Hopkins), but Redlands has a direct win over Bates, an indirect over Hopkins via Bates, and no bad losses. Check out their defeats (Williams #3, CMS x2 #5, Santa Cruz #6, Cal Lu x2 #7, Trinity (TX) #8, and P-P #9.
While the fact that Redlands didn’t beat any of these teams shows that they’re not an elite opponent, they did beat everyone ranked below them – and even Bates, ranked two spots above them. As a former member of a team that played Redlands often, I really don’t like the Bulldogs, but their record dictates that they, not Bates, should be part of the NCAA field.
Also, I find it insane that everyone agreed at the beginning of the season that SCIAC wouldn’t have more than 2 teams in the tournament. They have 4. What a crazy year this has been.
Maybe I am missing something, it’s hard for me to understand the argument that Bates gets in ahead of Redlands when Redlands beat them 7-2! That has to be a HUGE determining factor. Unless Bates was missing their top two players that day or there is some other info I am not seeing.
REALLY? THAT WAS THE FIRST WEEK OF THE SEASON. BATES HAD NO BAD LOSES AFTER THAT. THEY SPANKED HOPKINS. THE SPANKED MARY WASH. THEY WENT 5-4 WITH AMHERST. CHECK YOUR RECORDS. THE NCAA COMMITTEE USED TO ALWAYS MORE WEIGHT ON HOW YOU FINISH. HOW DID REDLANDS FINISH?……
Bates has a better overall resume, no question. But that 7-2 does look very bad for them, any way you slice it, and all I’m saying is that if it is between those two teams, I don’t think it’s too difficult to see how Redlands was chosen. I do feel that the selection process is a bit silly. Didn’t it used to be that the top 8 teams from each region made the tournament? Why was this changed? We have teams like Bates, Case, and Chicago sitting home when they are amongst the best teams in the nation, and I think its silly.
REALLY? REDLANDS HAS NO BUSINESS BEING IN TOURNEY. THEY BEAT BATES THE FIRST WEEK OF THE SEASON. BIG DEAL! THEY HAVE DONE NOTHING SINCE. JUST SO WE CAN SEE THEM PLAY CAL LU YET AGAIAN? NEXT YEAR!
Emory has to potentially beat 3 NESCAC teams in a row to win the Championship. They should have just invited Emory to their conference championships past weekend. I guess the loss to Bowdoin didn’t hurt Williams at all in terms of their seeding – tough luck for Kenyon and the winner of the West region who have to battle it out in the quarters.
How is it that an team with a 8-10 record is allowed in the tournament. You don’t see see the Sacramento Kings in the playoffs do you? How can you guys complain that Redlands get in when there are worse teams out there getting in.
I always thought it was the West coast teams having to play in a region of death each year that get screwed. Nope just the teams that get the shaft in favor of WashU without getting the chance to prove how undeserving they are of a 1 seed and gift wrapped walk to the elite 8.
Without Wash U’s history, this simply does not happen. They were one of the last teams to get into the tournament and they get a 1 seed. I didn’t realize pre-season rankings affected how the bracket is made 6 months later…
Last chance to fill out both D3 AND D1 brackets
Division 3: http://www.bracketmaker.com/tlist.cfm?tid=427873
Division 1: http://www.bracketmaker.com/tlist.cfm?tid=427986
Anyone know if CMS will televise the matches on their courts?
Does not appear that CMS will have video; they will have live scoring. Whatever they do, you can access it by clicking on the CMS Tennis link on this site and finding the live scoring link and/or the video link.
Update: Host site CMS will have live video for West Regional matches, beginning tomorrow at 1:00 PM Pacific Standard Time with #7 California Lutheran vs. #16 Redlands.
http://www.firstteambroadcasting.com/organizations/claremont-mudd-scripps-athletics/
No it does indeed appear that there will be video feed for all CMS matches this weekend.
http://www.bracketmaker.com/tlist.cfm?tid=427873
Face off with your brackets here. So far the predictions have been very one-sided. Publish your different perspective.
I agree…CMS has more grittiness this year…now they have to show it when it really matters.
I think CMS is the biggest wildcard in this tournament. They have the potential to do anything from losing in the round of 16 to winning the whole thing
Very true. This CMS team is unlike any other one of their predecessors. Year in year out they were a powerhouse but when it came time for the big event they just always seemed to find a way to disappoint. This year’s team by no means dominated their opponents as they have in the past but that incredible talent is still there and they are wayyyyyy more battle-hardened than any incarnation of the CMS tennis team before them. Their spectrum is anywhere from pulling a Swarthmore match to also bringing that team that beat Amherst 6-3 last year. I firmly think that if they do manage to make it out of the region of death (surely favored but you just never know) than they will make tidy work of Kenyon and will pose a SERIOUS threat and I’ll even take them for the upset of Herst.
Emory vs Amherst – NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP MATCH, END OF DISCUSSION
Elite Eight:
Amherst v. Wash U
Kenyon v. Claremont-Mudd-Scripps
Emory v. Middlebury
Williams v. Bowdoin
Final Four:
Amherst v. C-M-S
Middlebury v. Bowdoin
National Championship:
C-M-S v. Bowdoin
It’s been a crazy year!
This year will result in another Emory v. Amherst NCAA final. Do not know why we are showing Washu or an undeserving Redlands any attention. My pick goes to Emory. They seem to have something different this year, and Browning is at his best, showing this by going a solid 20-0 this season. Amherst looks like they have dropped a level from last year, and it is certainly open for the taking (for maybe 1 or 2 other teams). I Look forward to this weekend and the next couple weeks where we will see most of these responses either crumble or come to fruition. Final 4- Amherst v CMS, Emory v Williams. Final- Emory over Herst.
Despite valid points regarding Wash U and Bates, but there are some exciting early round matchups in the tournament:
Cal Lu vs Redlands (law of averages and frustration from losing so many close matches may finally turn in Redland’s favor, plus doubles will save their day)
P-P vs Santa Cruz (UCSC looking to reassert themselves when it counts)
Skidmore (now at full strength with Jimmy Sherpa back) vs Trinity (TX), two tough teams with strong doubles lineups…should be quite a battle
Whitman (still looking for respect despite a great year)vs under-rated and very tough NC Wesleyan
Coe vs Grinnel (neither team ranked or a threat to Wash U. but it should be another nailbiter)
Why is everyone talking about the controversy surrounding Redlands vs. Bates, but no one is really talking about the decision between WashU & Bates? Redlands beat Bates. Whether the match was played in February or yesterday, Redlands has the direct win. But what about how the seasons of Bates and WashU stack up against each another?
1) Neither team lost any matches to teams ranked outside the top 14 at the time the matches were played.
2) Both teams played top teams close (4-5 loses to Kenyon/Cruz for WashU, and 4-5 loses to Amherst/Middlebury for Bates).
3) Both teams beat all the teams they played that finished the season ranked below them. The best of those matches include:
WASHU: Carnegie (neutral), Case Western (neutral), and Skidmore (neutral)
BATES: Mary Wash (away), Trinity CT (away), MIT (home)
There is no difference between these schools unless i’m forgetting something…
Bates beat Johns Hopkins 7-2 at Hopkins while WashU lost 5-4 to Johns Hopkins at a neutral site. If their resumes are so similar except for the INDIRECT WIN the Bobcats have over the Bears, then how does it make sense that WashU is in the tournament, and Bates is not?
My guess Big Jeff B. is that the Ncaa comittee did not want 5 NESCAC schools. Clearly, Bates is more deserving than Wash U. Bates will be fine. Next year should be a really strong one for them and hopefully they will not have to relay on fate. I hope those kids will use this for motivation to have a great year.
lets all just keep crying
Yup. Well said. Of course you also missed the point where the NCAA apparently awards 90% of your seed on what you have done in previous years. Other than that spot on and I completely agree with you.
Again, realize that if this is done for one sport, it must be done for all sports. So each of the 20 or so sports would have to agree to this “election” to move out teams who can afford to pay their own way. Don’t see that happening.
I have absolutely no experience in dealing with the NCAA rules, but I don’t think I’m bad at proposing possible solutions to perceived problems. If this change must be approved for all 20 sports to be used for men’s NCAA tennis, so be it. I don’t think that should be a big deal in terms of the ease of it being applied to all sports.
Guidelines could be established that the NCAA selection committee would only move a team that applied to be available to be shipped out of a region, at their own expense, in the interests of attempting to even out the overall parity between NCAA regions, and that the selection committee would have the total discretion to accept or reject any application by any team indicating that they would accept such a move outside their region. The overall parity guideline SHOULD BE IN PLACE NOW ANYWAY, AND BE REQUIRED BY THE NCAA SELECTION COMMITTEE TO FOLLOW (and, if not, should be immediately put in place in the future), so this would be just a minor application, or example, of how the overall parity rule could be applied.
However, I must say if this overall parity guideline is currently in place, the selection committee certainly did not do a good job of following it this year, as many of the comments to this blog address.
One possible solution to the problem of the west region’s yearly overabundance of quality teams is to request that teams in that region submit a statement that they are willing to fly out to another region, and pay for all of their own travel expenses, if the NCAA feels it would equalize overall regional quality (which presumably the selection committee wants to do). So, for instance, if PP, the #2 seed in the west, submitted that request on a timely basis before the selection committee made their request (which would have to be done before their league championship tourney, which is right before the NCAA selections are determined), then the NCAA could ship them to another region of their choice (not P-P’s choice), P-P would pay for their travel expenses, and then the selection committee could ship another team at the NCAA’s expense, using the existing three team 500 mile rule, such as Texas Tyler, to the west region, from the Emory region. Arguably this doesn’t change the overall selection rules, at least not much, so it may be deemed to be consistent with the “one rule for all D3 sports” rule.
So would you allow teams to bring more than 8 players if teams pay for their expenses?
No, that would provide an unfair advantage to the team making the election to be shipped out of their region, which the selection committee could choose to accept or reject in their total discretion.
I agree with your theory in principle. However, this is completely unfair for schools/teams with less money than others. A private school team can have a better path to the NCAA’s then UC Santa Cruz who could not afford to pay their way out of their region?
I should also point out, in addition to my comment made below, that it would seem that it would be a very rare experience for an NCAA selection committee to deem it necessary to ship a team, that requested it be shipped, to another region to achieve overall parity between each region.
Off the top of my head, I can’t see that occurring in any other sport, except maybe lacrosse, which seems to be a sport the players in east excel in compared to other areas of the country, though I don’t even know if there is a D3 championship for that sport. If I am correct on this, the unfairness issue you raise relating to private schools is severely diminished.
P-P will probably be the #3 seek in the west region, but it doesn’t make any difference to whether my idea makes any sense. As long as I’m writing this, I should point out that if P-P were able to make this “election,” it would run the risk of being shipped to a regional where the top seed is ranked even higher than CMS. However, P-P, if they wanted to spend the money, might think it would be a good idea to go elsewhere and potentially even play a tougher team than CMS, for several reasons, to go play somewhere out of state in the NCAA’s.
WashU made the bracket.
Very accurate post though, love the fire
Pretty sure he was insinuating that they (Washington University of St. Louis) were not the “creators” of the bracket. Thus, don’t direct any anger towards them or their program because they were uninvolved in the process. Obviously they are included in the bracket…aka “made the bracket”. But you clearly completely mis-read his post.
On another note, can we get down to talking about the actual tournament at this point? Obviously there are some flaws in the process and I agree that Bates got the short end of the stick…But it is really tough to argue when you directly lose 7-2 (only 2 wins being in 3 set breakers), no matter when the match was. Again, we can all agree some things should/need to be changed, but nothing’s about to change between now and Friday…So can we begin to talk about tennis, and the matches that will be played. And save the banter and rule changing posts until after the tournament?
Comments on Wash U. They didn’t make the bracket. They also did what they needed to do to make the tournament. They beat Case, DePauw, Chicago and when it came time to make it happen they came back from 3-0 down after doubles to beat Carnegie 5-4. Bates and Redlands couldn’t do it when they needed to. Redlands was rewarded for not getting the job done and Bates wasn’t. Wash U will have to beat Gustavus who could sweep them in doubles, but in the end Wash U didn’t make the bracket.
Redlands beat bates 7-2, and the two matches bates won were won in third sets with scores of 11-9 and 12-10. i don’t care what the argument is about their recent performance, redlands was a handful of points from winning 9-0. game set match redlands showed they were better than bates and thus why they got the 7th pool C bid
That’s ok. Go Cal Lu! Again. And Again. Oh, this will be 3 times!
That match was in February…………..Not to mention Redlands arguably has the worst courts in Division III tennis
I think there is too much complaining. We don’t live in a perfect world and it’s not a perfect draw, but I don’t think it was surprise to anybody that something like this would happen – NCAA has had this method for who knows how long. This happened this year and will happen in the future. Sooner the people get over their disappointment and focus on some incredible match-ups that the draw actually offers, the better for all of us.
I repeat a question i asked earlier: How long has the NCAA been doing the selection process this way? Only 10-11 years I believe. And can someone explain how it was done before?
this is all a joke. i mean, it’s great and all that the teams who win their weak conferences are given a chance to play in NCAA’s, but how about rewarding the top teams (i.e., all the aforementioned teams who are NOT in the tourney) with a chance to compete in post season play? sorry but it’s not like schools like grinnell deserve a chance over say, bates.
From a post just above yours that I wrote out:
Also the unranked teams who are in ridiculously easy conferences who get auto-bids need to stop being allowed to go to the tournament. They just dont’ compare to all the nationally ranked teams who are in the teens or in the 20′s that don’t make it. Just not fair.
Because of the set up that NCAA has for D3, I think a plan that could really work out is, have the national rankings flat out make the the field. Expand the rankings to the top 50 in the nation instead of 30. Allowed the top 48 teams to play in the bracket. The top 16 teams get byes. I know that traveling would come into play but I’m sure the price to having an actual fair bracket actually made for once in D3 would outweigh the cost to actually have the teams travel a little bit more to make it fair.
Why not have this happen?
It couldn’t/won’t happen because:
1) NCAA institutes a method for postseason across the board, not just tennis, so when considering what is best for one sport, it likely won’t make sense for the rest.
2) $$. As nice as it would be, the NCAA isn’t going to think that the cost is outweighed by fairness. It wouldn’t be as simple as just adding one flight. It would be adding a flight for each sport. Imagine doing the bracket based on the rankings, expanding the rankings, and then trying to create balanced regionals. The amount of flights would fluctuate each year, and it would likely mean multiple flights for just one region. Multiply that by the 20 or so (number of D3 championships) and cost becomes a major issue.
I love the idea of a championship that is representative of the quality of D3 tennis, and the NCAA does itself harm the way it is set up, but I don’t see that changing anytime soon.
watch out for the gusties to come out of their region
There are 6 teams that have golden roads to the elite 8 and then 2 tough regions. I may be a little impartial when saying this but I feel NC Wes can pull out the win against Whitman. They have the talent to beat Emory but can they all pull it together the same day? I don’t know but can’t wait to see what happens. Looking forward to the Middlebury-Hopkins match. You never know what can happen in this one. Bowdoin-Trinity will probably come down to who wins doubles. I would love to see a possible whitewater or gustavus upset over Wash U. More than likely won’t happen but would make for a good story for one of these other programs. The California region is always a battle for all these teams and I feel for them. It can basically come down to who is on that day. Amherst won’t be tested until the Final 4 with a possible Kenyon or CMS match. Not the best draw I’ve ever seen but it is what it is. Looking forward to seeing what happens. D
The talent level was certainly evident against Kenyon and Chicago this year and NC Wesleyan had a great year only losing twice. Whitman will have their hands full and probably will rightfully view themselves as underdogs, I imagine. Plus Whitman will be crossing three time zones to play…farther than any other team has to travel. My vote is this regional is the second toughest behind California, though #1 seed Emory is arguably stronger than CMS as a #1 seed. And if NC Wesleyan players can match up and compete well against Emory players (and you should know) then that only proves my point.
You mean partial (biased), not impartial (unbiased), correct? Also, although the results may be outdated, I just looked up results between Emory and NCW from the fall regionals: Halpern (#5 singles) beat Rumyantsev (#3 singles) in three sets, while Ruderman (#6) beat Khussainov (#1) in straights. Like I said, that was some time ago, but still interesting to think about. No doubt that NCW is talented; however, they yet to break through with a win of this caliber. If they can step up their doubles play, much as Kjellberg and Rumyantsev did in the fall regionals, then they very well may become a force to reckon with. There is no doubt they will feel disrespected in regards to the rankings and will come out firing against Whitman.
Even amidst all of the issues that have arisen, this tournament has a lot of entertaining matchups to offer. Can’t wait to see another big upset.
Dustin, nice comments and I would like to respond. My thoughts are: NC wes has no chance against Emory. Middlebury will destroy Hopkins. Bowdoin will destroy Trinity-TX. Wash U? Don’t care…they have no business in the tourney. In the end, Nobody and I mean Nobody will come close to touching Amherst. They are heads and shoulders above anyone else in the country. I am not an Amherst fan, but a realist.
I think you’re a little too excited there. Remember this is the national tournament and you’re saying that teams are going to get “destro[ed]”. I don’t think so. First, Middlebury/Hopkins is going to be a good match I think. Hopkins’s singles is very very strong and middlebury’s mid-bottom lineup isnt as top notch as one might think. Second, although I agree that Emory will cruise in their region, I’m not sure if I would go ahead and give the win to Wesleyan over Whitman so easily. That should be a battle. And thirdly, remember that Trinity spanked Bowdoin earlier this season. Sure it was in March but Trinity’s strengths are Bowdoin’s as well. Bowdoin has been sweeping the dubs against everyone and remember that Trinity swept them. Basically my point is that you shouldn’t overlook any regional (except maybe Herst’s regional) because this is the national tournament. Weird things have happened.
Sorry for the essay but even though the tournament draw seems all messed up, it wil be interesting to see the how the matches play out. With some of these big time schools battling it out. As a fan of D3 tennis, that’s all I can ask for.
NCWC does have a shot at Emory if they get past Whitman. Granted it is a small shot and if they are not up after doubles they won’t win. I also feel Middlebury beats down on Hopkins just based on previous years results in NCAA. I am not an Amherst fan either but I think you are right that they will be holding the trophy at the end of the year. I am glad that the tournament is in Cary so I can see all the Elite 8 matches without having to fly. And yeah I meant partial. It was late when I was writing and my 14 month old son was running around. All I am saying is watch for the Bishops to try to send Modise out on a good note as this is his last season bc he is going D1 next year. D
CMS Regional. 4 teams top 10 (#5,6,7,9) and Redlands #16 in the nation. D3 needs to start doing it like D1 teams do. I know that D3 doesn’t have enough money to do all that, but these team draws are looking just absolutely ridiculous. Possibly make the final site for the top 16 teams. California is getting killed by the location and the distance they are from everyone. Also the unranked teams who are in ridiculously easy conferences who get auto-bids need to stop being allowed to go to the tournament. They just dont’ compare to all the nationally ranked teams who are in the teens or in the 20’s that don’t make it. Just not fair.
Because of the set up that NCAA has for D3, I think a plan that could really work out is, have the national rankings flat out make the the field. Expand the rankings to the top 50 in the nation instead of 30. Allowed the top 48 teams to play in the bracket. The top 16 teams get byes. I know that traveling would come into play but I’m sure the price to having an actual fair bracket actually made for once in D3 would outweigh the cost to actually have the teams travel a little bit more to make it fair.
Comments?
I love your plan.Perhaps it needs a little tweaking but the concept is first rate. I made a similar point in a previous post: to have 5 top 20 teams in one region and then Wash U placed where they are…weird. Frankly, this is a quasi- national championship. Until the regions are more equitable, some teams are going to be fresher. Finally, it seems like CMS, Cal Lu, P-P, Redlands have to play each other over and over and only one team has a chance to get to the final 8…It’s a great tournament but not a fair, true national championship.
Too many aq bids to teams that are terrible. I love this idea. california teams get absolutely hosed by this format
This is obviously nic ballou
I know people probably won’t agree, but Emory’s draw could be pretty tough. If it plays out as the rankings go and they can make it to the finals rematch with Amherst, they’ll play #20 W&L, #11 Whitman (still an unknown), #12 Middlebury (tough out at this point), #3 Williams (only one speed bump this season), then #1 Amherst (seemingly unstoppable).
Not an easy road at all for the #2 team, though that pales in comparison to the CMS Regionals draw. That’s going to be a bloodbath.
Everyone in the Emory region got screwed. Emory will almost certainly get out of that region, but compare that draw to Amherst’s. They just have to beat TCNJ or Vassar (two teams they could beat with their “B” lineup)
Switch Emory and Washu and the draw would make much more sense.
Ignoring the random Wheaton spammer and the raging Redlands controversy, I feel like this bracket really sucks for Whitman. They put together a solid season, beat Cruz, and then got stuffed in a regional with Emory. Even if you think the Cruz win was fluky it’s still pretty ridiclous.
Also Redlands: I feel this blog will have a meltdown if Redlands beats Cal-Lu, just saying. While maybe Redlands isn’t the most deserving team in the tournament from Pool C, I’m actually fine with them. Direct over Bates (no matter how long ago it was) and no bad losses. I think equal arguments can be made for their exclusion and inclusion.
WHITMAN FANS READ
Just going to throw this out there, Whitman played Cruz when one of there top doubles and singles players wasn’t even in the line up because he was ineligible at the time. The win isn’t as legit as everyone may think. The reason for Cruz’s success if having that one player back in the singles and doubles line up for the second half of the season. This is why they are so good now. They weren’t nearly as strong as it clearly shows without that last starting player.
To be fair to Whitman, they beat the same team that beat CMS, Trinity, and Wash U, so it’s not like the Cruz team they beat was weak. Also, Larsen hasn’t really done much for Cruz since he’s been back except solidify their doubles lineup. Finally, the Whitman/Cruz match wasn’t really that close. 6-3 Whitman with match points in one of the matches they lost; whereas, Cruz lost pretty soundly in their 6 losses.
All that aside, Whitman hasn’t looked great since then, and shouldn’t really be complaining about their draw because at least they’re not in California where they would have little or no chance of even getting to the Sweet Sixteen.
Whitman really should not be upset. They are near the top, if not at the top of the list at being the highest ranked, weak team. If that makes sense. They do have a decent chance at doing well in the region that they got selected to be in. I just really think California needs to be split up. It’s 5 teams who play each other ALL THE TIME! how is that fair to not give 4 top 10 teams a chance to make it to the elite 8. Only 1 team gets a chance.
Also to include about Whitman, they beat no teams inside the top 20 (besides Cruz without their full lineup) and the 3 teams they beat that are even nationally ranked aren’t that impressive of wins. They beat all weak teams to get the record they have. Have them fly out to Southern California since they are close and see how they stack up against Claremont, Pomona, Cal Lu and Redlands. They are like the Boise State of D3tennis. They kill a bunch of weak teams and have no big wins during the season. And that one match against Cruz was as if Cruz was without their starting quarterback (A lot weaker)
Totally agree on potential blog meltdown but I’m calling it now, Redlands will beat Cal Lu in that play in match. I don’t see them losing a 3rd time to them with the way Cal Lu is skidding and the bad blood between the two teams now should propel them over their rival. That doesn’t change the fact that they were completely unable to win any big match in the season and have no shot to come out of the region but I do think that Cal Lu is quickly fading and won’t be able to get the Wilson win a second time. My prediction is more a loss a faith in Cal Lu now than it is an endorsement for Redlands. Of course they could prove just how unclutch they are and lose to this team a 3rd time but for once I think they’ll do it.
Wilson’s match was a walkover in this match!
this bracket is a joke for several reasons: 1) Wash U as a 1 seed. 2) Cruz PP Cal Lu Redlands and CMS all in the same region 3) Whitman drawing NCW in Emory’s region. I guess I can see how Redlands gets in over Bates, but thats a toss up. Overall, some really awful decision made
It’s the system but it does seem that two West Coast teams deserve to have a shot at the final 8. Those teams have to keep beating up on EACH other. Hopefully the winner of that region will go to Cary mentally tough…no cupcakes there.
Wheaton is questionable to be in. If there was one more Pool B it would probably be there’s for the taking. Johnson at 1 is a solid player but one of the cciw coaches said he is leaving. They do have a win over Grinnell and an indirect win over Coe (both in the tournament) and had a close match with Luther. Sadly for them try are in the cciw. Last 10 years it’s winner has made it except for Carthage in 2011…further pushing the point that because of the one less pool c bid, they got screwed.
I’d be interested in seeing an informal ranking of regionals from hardest to easiest (or vice versa)–i.e., the hardest and easiest paths to the quarters.
Wash U has a good deal on one hand, but they also have to play Amherst if they squeak out of their region– so much for the final 4 streak. I look forward to their match vs. Gustavus. Actually, will Gustavus beat Whitewater? They lost to them in the regular season.
DON’T COMPLAIN ABOUT WASH U’S DRAW. THEY HAVE NO BUSINESS EVEN BEING IN THE TOURNEY.
i don’t think he was complaining, just saying that their draw isn’t as much of a cakewalk as people are making it sound.
No its a complete cakewalk. They don’t deserve that easy path to the final 8. I could care less about what happens when they get to play Amherst, I’m upset because they don’t deserve that easy opportunity to get there in the first place.
Whoever is using the capital letters and freaking out at everyone’s comments should probably relax. You don’t seem very well informed and you should realize that much of this tournament is determined based on what you are ranked in your respective region. Thats how the NCAA works, much of it is based on equal opportunity. That is probably why washu and Redlands are in a bates isn’t.
Wow WashU once again has a ridiculously soft path to the final 8. Really selection committee? Couldn’t put Whitman or Trin Tx there since you were already flying them? Instead you place them on teams with far better seasons? What a joke.
Do you know when the doubles/singles draws are released?
Doubles and Singles SELECTIONS come out May 9th in the early afternoon most likely. The DRAWS will be made i believe a day or two before the individual tournament actually begins.
Wheaton lost to WashU 9-0 and have beat no one. Are you kidding me?
Wheaton definitely got worked. They belong in the tourney. Also, Wash U and Gustavus as the top seeds in a region is questionable. Lucky for them.
Wheaton got worked? A team that doesn’t have a top 30 win and only took 1 point off of a ranked opponent? That’s who got worked??
I think you mixed Wheaton up with Whitman. I’m no Whitman fan, but you’ve got to feel bad for those guys. Not only do they not host or have a #1 seed, they were drawn with NC Wesleyan and EMORY. Yes, Whitman’s record is much less impressive than many other teams, but they’re undefeated – and they draw EMORY! That’s just cold. In fact, it’s entirely within the realm of possibilities that Whitman may not even win a round – NC Wesleyan is extremely dangerous…
And of course, there’s the California regional that features four top 10 teams… But by all means, continue telling us that Wheaton got worked.
i agree, i can’t see how wheaton could have made the tournament. Yea, they had a nice season with 12 in a row at the end, but who did they beat in those 12? Not sure if those comments were a joke or not…
Anonymous on May 7, 2012 at 3:55 pm
Wheaton is questionable to be in. If there was one more Pool B it would probably be there’s for the taking. Johnson at 1 is a solid player but one of the cciw coaches said he is leaving. They do have a win over Grinnell and an indirect win over Coe (both in the tournament) and had a close match with Luther. Sadly for them try are in the cciw. Last 10 years it’s winner has made it except for Carthage in 2011…further pushing the point that because of the one less pool c bid, they got screwed.
REPLY
They didn’t get “screwed.” There is one less Pool B slot, and they’re clearly behind all of the current Pool B holders in terms of getting one of those spots. Their results simply don’t indicate that Wheaton should be included in the field.
Moreover, their wins over Grinnell and Coe are irrelevant since those teams qualified by winning their conferences. Since Wheaton isn’t part of an AQ conference, they don’t have that opportunity. That doesn’t mean that they’ve been “screwed,” it’s simply the way the rules work. Bates and Whitman – those are teams that got “screwed.” And besides, don’t you think teams that narrowly missed the cut like Bates would easily be able to have wins over the vaunted Grinnell and Coe if they had played those teams?
Simply stated, Wheaton has no reason whatsoever to complain.
Wheaton didn’t get screwed at all. At best one could say that they had bad luck with the one less bid this year for non-AQs. While winning their conference was great for them, their best wins were Elmhurst x2 (12th in the central region at their peak, and Grinnell. If you want to talk about teams getting screwed, look at a team like Chicago.
http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/3p6b1d/
Redlands in the tournament is an absolute joke
As uninspired as Redlands’ inclusion is, they have a better overall record than Bates. Yes, Bates has a better win (v. Johns Hopkins), but Redlands has a direct win over Bates, an indirect over Hopkins via Bates, and no bad losses. Check out their defeats (Williams #3, CMS x2 #5, Santa Cruz #6, Cal Lu x2 #7, Trinity (TX) #8, and P-P #9.
While the fact that Redlands didn’t beat any of these teams shows that they’re not an elite opponent, they did beat everyone ranked below them – and even Bates, ranked two spots above them. As a former member of a team that played Redlands often, I really don’t like the Bulldogs, but their record dictates that they, not Bates, should be part of the NCAA field.
Also, I find it insane that everyone agreed at the beginning of the season that SCIAC wouldn’t have more than 2 teams in the tournament. They have 4. What a crazy year this has been.
Maybe I am missing something, it’s hard for me to understand the argument that Bates gets in ahead of Redlands when Redlands beat them 7-2! That has to be a HUGE determining factor. Unless Bates was missing their top two players that day or there is some other info I am not seeing.
REALLY? THAT WAS THE FIRST WEEK OF THE SEASON. BATES HAD NO BAD LOSES AFTER THAT. THEY SPANKED HOPKINS. THE SPANKED MARY WASH. THEY WENT 5-4 WITH AMHERST. CHECK YOUR RECORDS. THE NCAA COMMITTEE USED TO ALWAYS MORE WEIGHT ON HOW YOU FINISH. HOW DID REDLANDS FINISH?……
Bates has a better overall resume, no question. But that 7-2 does look very bad for them, any way you slice it, and all I’m saying is that if it is between those two teams, I don’t think it’s too difficult to see how Redlands was chosen. I do feel that the selection process is a bit silly. Didn’t it used to be that the top 8 teams from each region made the tournament? Why was this changed? We have teams like Bates, Case, and Chicago sitting home when they are amongst the best teams in the nation, and I think its silly.
REALLY? REDLANDS HAS NO BUSINESS BEING IN TOURNEY. THEY BEAT BATES THE FIRST WEEK OF THE SEASON. BIG DEAL! THEY HAVE DONE NOTHING SINCE. JUST SO WE CAN SEE THEM PLAY CAL LU YET AGAIAN? NEXT YEAR!
Emory has to potentially beat 3 NESCAC teams in a row to win the Championship. They should have just invited Emory to their conference championships past weekend. I guess the loss to Bowdoin didn’t hurt Williams at all in terms of their seeding – tough luck for Kenyon and the winner of the West region who have to battle it out in the quarters.
Wheaton should be in there. 18-5 with 12 match win streak
How is it that an team with a 8-10 record is allowed in the tournament. You don’t see see the Sacramento Kings in the playoffs do you? How can you guys complain that Redlands get in when there are worse teams out there getting in.
Redlands can upset some teams. What about gustavus adolphus free ride to the quarters
REDLANDS CAN’T UPSE ANYONE. REMEMBER, WE GET TO SEE THEM PLAY CAL LU AGAIN. 1 AND DONE.
Can someone please explain to me how Wash U is a 1 seed? Bueller? Bueller?
I always thought it was the West coast teams having to play in a region of death each year that get screwed. Nope just the teams that get the shaft in favor of WashU without getting the chance to prove how undeserving they are of a 1 seed and gift wrapped walk to the elite 8.
Without Wash U’s history, this simply does not happen. They were one of the last teams to get into the tournament and they get a 1 seed. I didn’t realize pre-season rankings affected how the bracket is made 6 months later…
UNBELIEVEABLE!!!! REDLANDS????? WASH U???????????